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Author Topic: The "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off" Continues!!! (19 messages, Page 1 of 1)
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Bug Dr

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Posted: Jul 4, 2010 06:32 PM  (Msg. 1 of 19)         

Many of you have seen the start of the battery tests (summer '09) affectionately referred to as:

the "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off".


These tests have been conducted by eight independent testers at four different testing facilities.  Descriptions and results of the first set of tests (#1-17) are listed in this thread. Have a look at that thread for complete details of results for tests 1 through 17.  (The previous thread is locked so no additional test results can be posted in that thread.)

This thread will be used to discuss the results of all subsequent tests.

The batteries in the tests are shown in the image below.


From left to right (in order of arrival) the batteries include:
The MotoBatt MBTX16U                          (MBatt)
The Scorpion sYTX16BS1                        (SBatt)
The Odyssey PC535                               (OBatt – Pre-mod form of the GBat)
The Westco SVR14                                (WBatt)
The BatteriesPlus Xtreme XTX16BS1         (XBatt)

Each of the lines above includes a link to the pre-test description of the particular battery.

Most of these batteries were donated either by major US distributors, the manufacturer, or the like, or sold at dealer's cost.  Two were completely free of charge.  One I paid $15 shipping.  Two were sent at dealer's cost.  In total around $90 was invested in acquiring the batteries.


This thread will be used to discuss the results of all subsequent tests.

The Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off is STILL underway!


©  Copyright 2010  -  by Bug Dr.  All Rights Reserved.   Contact motorcyclebatteries@gmail.com for permission to use any information or reproduce figures or data either electronically or in print.





Edited by Bug Dr on Jul 4, 2010 at 06:35 PM


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Jul 4, 2010 06:32 PM  (Msg. 2 of 19)         

TEST REPORTS – Tests 18-20
The "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off"
TESTS 18-20:  Eight Month Down Time Tests

Following Test 17, each of the batteries was fully recharged, reboxed in their original packaging and placed in a cabinet for eight months.  Following the "Eight Month Down Time" the retained voltage on each battery was measured and recorded.  The batteries were then each placed in a functional cold 2003 VS1400 and tested for 1) Headlight Intensity and 2) Ability to Repeatedly Start the VS1400 Motor.

The numerical data for each of these tests is recorded in the table below and represented graphically in the three subsequent graphs.



Data for the OBatt (pre-modified GBat) could not be obtained for Tests 18-20 at this time.  The OBatt was modified in our facility and made to fit the battery box of a VS1400.  It was used to power a VS1400 for the last 8 months.  It should be noted that the OBatt powered the VS1400 without fail during the 8 month "down-time" period.   Even after the grueling testing involved in Tests 1-17, the OBatt delivered strong starting power through its 8 month 'ride test'.  Following Tests 18-20 the MBatt was placed in the same VS1400 and will be used to power the VS1400 for the next 8 month period.  At the end of this second 8 month period, the OBatt will be tested in the same conditions to collect data for Test 18-20 comparison.  At the end of each subsequent eight-month 'down-time', the OBatt and the MBatt will be alternated powering the bike to test longevity of each.


TEST REPORT – Test 18
The "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off"
TEST 18:  Texas Toast Eight Month Down Time Voltage Retention Test



The retained voltage values for each battery were measured using the same instruments as in the previous tests (1-17).  The numerical values are shown graphically in the figure above.  While it appears that the SBatt and the WBatt retain significant charge, when the retained voltage values are used to determine the Industry Standard "% State of Charge" for each battery, the voltage values translate as follows.

MBatt %SOC        59.1%
SBatt %SOC          3.9%
WBatt %SOC       28.8%
XBatt %SOC       <0.0%   (11.5v is considered 0% SOC according to industry standard calculations.

Only the MBatt retained a State of Charge above 50% during the eight month down time.

Percent State of Charge and retained voltage are only two tests of a battery's functional properties.  In order to be functional, a battery must be able to use the stored voltage to push current through attached circuits.

Many times on IA, riders report that their headlight appears to be "brightly lit" but the starter is not able to start the bike or the starter is not turning over the engine.  Test 19 tests each of these batteries' ability to power the headlight and taillight circuits.  The relative numeric values for the headlight intensity when powered by each of the batteries is shown graphically in the figure below.


TEST REPORT – Test 19
The "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off"
TEST 19:  Texas Toast Eight Month Down Time Headlight Intensity Test



Each of the tested batteries was able to power the VS1400 headlight and taillight.  There were obvious differences in the intensity of the light emitted when powered by each battery.  The intensity was estimated visually for each battery and ranked on a 5-point scale.  The data for each is presented graphically in the figure above.

It should be noted that even the XBatt, with a %SOC far below zero was able to drive the headlight.  The intensity was much lower than any of the other batteries, but the headlight beam was just barely visible on an adjacent wall approximately 20 feet from the front of the VS1400 in a well-lit workshop area.

Powering the lighting circuit requires far less current than does driving the starter motor.  Many of us have had the unfortunate experience of finding that, at some point, our batteries did not have enough power to drive the VS1400 starter motor sufficiently to start the engine.  Following a long down-time, say eight months, this is all too common a scenario.

This led to the next question.  Do these batteries retain enough ability to produce the current necessary to drive the starter motor.  If they do, how many sequential motor starts are they capable of?

To test this question, following a brief evaluation of headlight intensity (test 19) each battery was tested for its ability to start a cold VS1400 engine.  For each battery, the starter button was depressed until the engine started.  If the engine started, the motor was immediately killed within 1 second.  The kill switch was reset to the run position and the test was repeated until failure to start occurred.  The test was run up to 25 successive starts if the battery did not fail to start the engine.

The numerical data of this engine start-up test is shown graphically in the next figure.


TEST REPORT – Test 20
The "Texas Toast Battery Cook-Off"
TEST 20:  Texas Toast Eight Month Down Start-Up Test



First, it should be noted that the SBatt and the XBatt failed to start the VS1400 motor.  These two batteries did not produce enough current to even make the starter motor click once.  The headlights simply dimmed, and there was no other indication of the starter turning.

The WBatt was able to start the bike 6 times.  On the sixth attempt, several revolutions of the engine were required before it started.  On the seventh attempt, the starter clicked, but failed to start the bike.  Obviously, only one start would normally be required of a battery under normal conditions following an 8 month down-time.  Following start-up, most likely the bike would be ridden and the WBatt battery would hopefully recharge enough during that ride to be useful on a daily ridden bike.  So the WBatt "passed the test" by being able to start the engine repeatedly.  But if extended numbers of starts were required, the WBatt may not provide enough power following such an extended down time.

The MBatt was able to start the bike repeatedly for 25 starts following the 8 months of down-time.  The battery starting intensity did not seem to drop off even after 25 repeated starts.  The test was discontinued after the 25 successful starts as the battery cables were becoming warm and we did not want to risk damaging the starter motor.

The MotoBattery was very successful at starting the VS1400, even after sitting for 8 months with no additional charge.  So far, the MotoBatt is the obvious winner of this test.  The OBatt will be tested with identical methods following the eight month down-time.  The OBatt was fully recharged yesterday and reboxed and place in the cabinet.  It will be tested in March of 2011.

Subsequent test cycles will include the MBatt and the OBatt (the pre-modified GBat).  Each will be run for eight months in the VS1400 while the other waits boxed on the shelf.  Sequential engine starts will be monitored following each shelf stay and reported in this thread.

It is obvious from all the test results that both the Motobattery and the Odyssey PC535 (OBatt and pre-modified GBat) are very durable and excellent batteries.  Longevity is one of the questions that the previous tests were unable to address.  Tests subsequent to Test 20 should be able to help address the longevity of each of these two batteries.

Look for more results to come in eight months or so.  If you have any questions, feel free to ask.  Any other comments or suggestions are appreciated as well.  If you simply need to bash one battery or another, feel free to do that in another thread.  Thanks.


©  Copyright 2010  -  by Bug Dr.  All Rights Reserved.  
Contact motorcyclebatteries@gmail.com for permission to use any information or reproduce figures or data either electronically or in print.





Edited by Bug Dr on Jul 4, 2010 at 09:36 PM


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Jul 4, 2010 06:33 PM  (Msg. 3 of 19)         

To date, the five batteries have been in testing for approximately one year.  They have been dead-dropped to zero volts for extended periods numerous times.  They have been used to start a 6.8L V10 engine repeatedly until dead.  They have been placed under 100A load on a forty 10-second-burst-cycle test until well below the industry standard of zero percent state-of-charge.  These batteries have been brutalized!!!

It should be stated that many of these batteries would serve well under "normal use" conditions.  The conditions of the "Texas Toast Battery Cook Off" have placed exceptional demands on these batteries.

Most riders would never force their batteries to endure such grueling, intense and continued torture.  However, at this point in the tests, the Scorpion battery (SBatt) and the BatteriesPlus Xtreme battery (XBatt) are no longer functional.  These two batteries and the WBatt have been removed from subsequent tests.




Only the MotoBatt MBTX16U  (MBatt)

and the Odyssey PC535 battery  (OBatt - pre modified GBat)

remain in testing.




Edited by Bug Dr on Jul 4, 2010 at 09:22 PM


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Jul 4, 2010 06:33 PM  (Msg. 4 of 19)         

Post For Place Holder for subsequent Data Posts.... (please do not delete)!


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Dec 31, 2010 05:19 PM  (Msg. 5 of 19)         

I have not made any updates to this thread since July.  The Odessey PC535 (converted to fit the VS1400/S83 as a GBat equivalent) is still in the middle of the "Eight Month Down Time Test" - @ month six now.  The PC535 will come off the shelf for testing in early-March.

In the mean time, the tortured MotoBatt battery is still performing flawlessly in the bike and has started the bike every time I have gone out for a ride this winter (about once or twice a week).   It is a trooper and just keeps on going.

(To see the results from all the testing performed, click the "Torture Test" link below.)


Edited by Bug Dr on Dec 31, 2010 at 05:20 PM


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Whitey22

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Posted: Feb 9, 2011 04:24 AM  (Msg. 6 of 19)         

Bug Dr I joined here just to TY for this awesome test I have recently had a Yuasa die after 4 good years of service(I maintain my Bikes well) but was thinking of something different this time and had seen the Motobat but was unsure of its abilities, after reading both posts I have definitely decided to give this Battery a Go! I don't ride an Intruder I ride a 2003 Kawi ZX9R (that's it in my avatar) I also have a GSXR 600 that is strictly a Track bike and Lucky me these 2 use the same size and model of Battery so Ill be snapping 2 of these up!   

Once Again TY for this Its great to get an Idea of what a new Product will do before you throw you hard earned green at it!

Kind Regards,
Whitey22


Edited by Whitey22 on Feb 9, 2011 at 04:31 AM


Bug Dr

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Posted: Feb 9, 2011 12:28 PM  (Msg. 7 of 19)         

Quote:
Whitey22 wrote:    Bug Dr I joined here just to TY for this awesome test I have recently had a Yuasa die after 4 good years of service(I maintain my Bikes well) but was thinking of something different this time and had seen the Motobat but was unsure of its abilities, after reading both posts I have definitely decided to give this Battery a Go! I don't ride an Intruder I ride a 2003 Kawi ZX9R (that's it in my avatar) I also have a GSXR 600 that is strictly a Track bike and Lucky me these 2 use the same size and model of Battery so Ill be snapping 2 of these up!    

Once Again TY for this Its great to get an Idea of what a new Product will do before you throw you hard earned green at it!

Kind Regards,
Whitey22



Welcome to IA Whitey22,

I am still running the MotoBatt from the tests in my bike.  Even after the brutality, it is still starting the bike fine.  In March I will take it back out of the bike, put in on the shelf again for 8 months and put the Odessey PC535 (GBat equivalent) back in the bike.

From what I have seen and heard from others the MotoBatt is a good solid choice for these bikes and many.  They have batteries that cover 108 different typical battery sizes.  As I have need, they will go in all my powersport toys!

Happy crusing Whitey22!  Keep that shiney side up!

Edited by Bug Dr on Feb 9, 2011 at 12:31 PM


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ge_morgan

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Posted: Apr 3, 2011 11:06 PM  (Msg. 8 of 19)         

Hi Bug Dr,

I just found this test because I was trying to find information on motobatt batteries (I was recommended one by my local atv shop). Thank you for the tests, it was very informative.

I just have one question. How did you decide on the batteries to test? Are these the best batteries available or just commonly used??

I ask because I am replacing a Katana battery (not sure if you have heard of them but i was very dissatisfied with it - I am replacing it after 3 weeks) and have the option to replace it with the original Polaris battery (which I can't find very much information on) or a motobatt and I wanted to know which one would be better.

Thanks in advance
Gareth


PRINCEMO
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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 07:06 AM  (Msg. 9 of 19)         

It looks tome like you are down to two batterys

The best being the G Batt at about $135.00 with a two year warrenty
and
the second best being Old Yeller (motto) at about $141.00 with a two year warrenty.

This was the call I made without any test based on the 2 year warrentys.

The folks that make them know what you can get out of them and thay make the warrenty to fit that.

Just my 2 cents.

Prince.

.
Edited by PRINCEMO on Apr 4, 2011 at 07:10 AM


Edited by PRINCEMO on Apr 4, 2011 at 07:23 AM


Prince

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you don't control immigration.


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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 07:57 AM  (Msg. 10 of 19)         



After an in depth analysis by a secret government electoral committee lasting more than a decade, it has been decided that 3 out of 4 people represent 75% of the population.






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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 08:06 AM  (Msg. 11 of 19)         

I got the MotoBatt at Amazon for under $100 with shipping


BugsInMyTeeth

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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 10:14 AM  (Msg. 12 of 19)         

And for rest of it's life in the bike you will wonder "Is it as good as a Gbat?"  Almost 5 years on my Gbat going strong.


Email to Jumpsummo@yahoo.com for Expanded tanks on 800 or 1400.

Gbat installed Sep 2007.

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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 10:41 AM  (Msg. 13 of 19)         

Quote:
jrjr wrote:
cheaper


Great price


Prince

The American Indians found out what happens when.....
you don't control immigration.


Save the earth..... I think it's the only planet with chocolate!






Bug Dr

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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 07:54 PM  (Msg. 14 of 19)         

Quote:
ge_morgan wrote:   Hi Bug Dr,

I just found this test because I was trying to find information on motobatt batteries (I was recommended one by my local atv shop). Thank you for the tests, it was very informative.

I just have one question. How did you decide on the batteries to test? Are these the best batteries available or just commonly used??

I ask because I am replacing a Katana battery (not sure if you have heard of them but i was very dissatisfied with it - I am replacing it after 3 weeks) and have the option to replace it with the original Polaris battery (which I can't find very much information on) or a motobatt and I wanted to know which one would be better.

Thanks in advance
Gareth


Hi Gareth,

I guess I would say that the lineup was chosen for several reasons.  The GBat is a modified Odyssey PC535 and it has been used for about 5-6 years.  Odyssey does not make a battery to fit our bike so several users here started modifying the PC535 to fit by trimming down the plastic fins on the side.  Then one member on the board made an agreement with Odyssey and started producing them for resell under the GBat tradename.

The modified PC535 has served very reliably for about 6-7 years in these bikes.  It carries a two year warranty. There are failures that have been reported, but they are relatively few.  The main problem with the PC535 is price.  No matter where one buys it, they run about $125 plus shipping.

The MotoBattery was a new product and I stumbled on to it when I was looking for a battery with longer than the typical 90 day warranty.  It carries a two year warranty as well.  So I included it in the tests.

The BatteriesPlus battery (XBatt in the tests) was the one I had been running and even though it has a one year warranty I wanted to include it because it is readily available in most cities in the USA through BatteriesPlus.  The other 'plus' is that they have a nation wide warranty so it can be replaced at any batteriesplus store.

The Westco battery was actually arranged by another IA member.  He was running one of their batteries (a different model) and he connected me with the Westco battery Rep that donated the battery.

The Scorpion was chosen because it was about the cheapest AGM battery I could find that is made to fit these bikes.

Most were donated by distributors.  Some I had to buy at dealer's cost.  There are other batteries out there.  But I did not want to include any with less than a 1 year warranty.  I hope that helps.

Bug Dr


Edited by Bug Dr on Apr 4, 2011 at 08:14 PM


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 07:57 PM  (Msg. 15 of 19)         

Quote:
PRINCEMO wrote: ......the second best being Old Yeller (motto) at about $141.00 with a two year warrenty.


Wow!  Prince!  How did you find that price????

I have never seen them sold for anything more than $85 including shipping to the door. Most places have them delivered for less than $80 to the door.

I hope no one uses that link you posted!


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Bug Dr

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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 08:09 PM  (Msg. 16 of 19)         

There are some great sources for the MotoBatt listed in the thread linked here.  The current discount code for Impact Batteries on the MotoBatt is "Quadflex".

If you use that code in the USA you can get it shipped for free and the total price is $83.38 delivered.


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Posted: Apr 4, 2011 09:03 PM  (Msg. 17 of 19)         

Quote:
jrjr wrote:   cheaper



That does look to be a very good price.  I cannot figure out what shipping charges are.  But if anyone buys through this company.  Please post what the shipping costs are here or in the other thread I linked above.

Thanks.


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Posted: Apr 10, 2011 10:50 AM  (Msg. 18 of 19)         

Very good work with the tests! My opinion is the Mbatt is the best battery out there right now, and surprisingly at a very good price. Thank you for your work, and for sharing the results.

Adam


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Posted: Apr 11, 2011 11:16 AM  (Msg. 19 of 19)         

Adam you might well be right...  It did win the testing so far.

But ONE battery hand picked by the seller compared against ONE battery that MANY here have verified many times over...  The point is ONE is not significant sample.  It will take years of people here standing by the Mbat to really verify it's status.

I'm so happy with my Gbats that I don't think I'll every buy a different one unless really in a jam.

After DECADES of putting up with crap replacement batteries no matter the price I'm just not willing to expose myself to the unknown if I can avoid it.

Besides it's a member who does a lot of good things for the group, granted mostly the LC guys get some cool stuff.  I'm just the sort of person that rewards good guys with my business even if I know I might save a couple bucks somewhere else.


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Back to S83/VS1400
 


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